This conversation recounted in this article was supposed to take place in a café.
Yet the reality is...
On the way to our meeting place, we came across a sidewalk refreshment stall with red and blue plastic chairs. Without hesitation, Tung recommended: Why don’t we just sit here?
In that very moment (and many others), I immediately recognized: street culture runs deep in his veins.
Tung Nguyen is the co-founder of craft beer brand Đê Mê (Deme Brewing). At the same time, he runs NEO-, an all-in-one hub serving as a café, a bar, a gallery of contemporary art and a creative social gathering hub in Saigon.
Around 20 years ago, when the internet had just emerged in Vietnam, he was quickly drawn into hip-hop, rock, and graffiti. “Back then, not many Vietnamese were into these things. But thanks to the internet, I found a global community with shared interests. As soon as we met in person, we hit it off right away”, Tung said, explaining how he's connected with many street artists from around the world.
Tung represented Vietnam in the Travelin' Man exhibition by Tim Williams (Optimist), a contemporary graffiti artist. He established a space where creative practitioners and culinary experts from Vietnam, Japan, Singapore, Malaysia, the US, Canada,... can meet up through year-round workshops and pop-ups.
In Wagamama UK magazine, he described his job as making a “melting pot” – a space where different cultures are brought together and blended.
“We blend but also ‘NEO-’ (which means ‘anchor’ in Vietnamese)”, he emphasized. So, amid all this diversity, what exactly does he choose to anchor down? I will save this question for later.
For now, prepare yourself a cold drink and step into the vibrant “alley” where Deme Brewing and NEO- are located.
What motivated you to establish Deme Brewing, and later NEO-?
As fate would have it, after all, just like how Đê Mê is also abbreviated as ĐM (ĐM also stands for Định Mệnh, the Vietnamese word for Destiny).
Around 2015-2016, craft beer culture had already grown popular in Saigon, but at that time I was just aware of it, not involved in it.
It wasn’t until 2017, after quitting a design job I’d been in for nearly 10 years, that I went up to Da Lat to take a break and started experimenting with homebrewing just for fun. At first, I only made small batches of around 10-20 liters. Then one day, unexpectedly, my friend placed a large “order” of about 300 liters - yet I still accepted it.
After brewing that batch and having some left over, I entered it in the IPA Challenge organized by BiaCraft Artisan Ales. It was just a trial, but surprisingly, it made it into the top 5. That’s when I took it seriously to start a business with my friends.
Initially, Deme mainly sold wholesale to restaurants and hotels nationwide. But destiny struck - COVID hit, everywhere shut down. Looking at my B2B sales declined by 80%, I realized I had to open a taproom to sell directly to customers.
By chance, one day I ventured into a small alley to “revisit” an abandoned house. It was a “revisit” because I'd discovered this house a few years before and occasionally stopped by like visiting an old accquaintance; but only then did I see a “For Rent” sign on the gate. More importantly, my wife was with me that day and supported the idea, so NEO- was born. Without her, I probably wouldn't have had the guts to do it.
NEO- is now a café, a bar and a workshop space. You’re running a business while operating many community activities. Do you ever feel “torn” between your different identities?
I see it just like day and night. During the day, I’m on the second floor drinking coffee and working on my laptop. In the evening, I go upstairs and drink beer. (laughs)
Doing business and community work aren’t necessarily opposing forces. I believe that only with a community can there be a business, and when it thrives, it can also create positive values for that community.
When I first moved here, some of my neighbors warned me not to rent an abandoned house. But now they’re happy that we’re around, making the alley more lively. Sometimes they even sit outside my place, playing guitar and drinking beer, which is very joyful. For me, who grew up in Saigon’s alleyways, finding a place like this was incredibly lucky.
That is why I see stakeholders in my business include not only partners and customers, but also my neighbors as well.
In fact, thanks to the “binding” responsibility of living in a shared residential place, we came up with new leisure experiences, such as “silent karaoke” - singing without disturbing anyone!
You’re also known as 'Cheekie'. Your cheerful energy and networking skills seem like a real advantage in business. Would you say they’re innate?
I don't know why people never believe me when I say I’m an introvert, a Capricorn - to be exact. (laughs)
But the truth is, I’m not naturally extroverted. It's all about practice.
When I was young, my parents ran a small entertainment business with pool tables, karaoke boxes and video games right in our house, located in the old Nancy market area of District 5. Whenever I woke up and walked downstairs, there were always people around. So early on, I got used to meeting and talking to people from all walks of life.
At 17, I worked at KFC simply because I thought I’d meet many foreigners there. I applied as a receptionist, but then my manager noticed my English skills and frequently asked me to help with interpretation. Thanks to being proactive, at 23, I became the youngest manager at KFC back then. This gave me opportunities to work across departments and meet many people.
Ironically, none of those experiences made me want to “connect communities” or “bridge cultures”. The actual reason came from something much more complicated - something like an existential crisis.
At 13, my parents made me move out because the area we were living in was quite complicated. By the age of 15 or 16, many of my childhood friends in that neighborhood had already passed away, and only one or two remained.
At the time, I didn’t know why I had to move out. But that very experience shaped me in two ways: On one hand, I am independent, and on the other hand, I have developed a strong sense of collective culture drawn from both Vietnamese and Chinese traditions.
Not to mention, growing up when the internet brought foreign cultures to Vietnam, I often felt "drifting" between two worlds. Vietnamese people often mistook me for a foreigner (probably because I looked so hip-hop back then). Foreigners assumed I was an international student, though I was born and raised in Vietnam without ever having been overseas.
From 17 to 26, I felt terrible, constantly obsessing over not belonging anywhere.
Only later did I accept that it was okay. I learned to navigate both worlds, and in doing so, I became a catalyst that brings people together.
The name NEO- reflects that idea. In English, NEO- is a prefix. it only makes sense only if it stands with another word. As soon as it does, it renews the word.
That’s why NEO- maintains collaboration with many others to hold creative activities, otherwise NEO- standing alone would just be neo đơn (lonely in Vietnamese)!
NEO- also means “anchor” in Vietnamese. So what do you do to anchor down your brand identity?
Definitely I must keep the Vietnamese values, or at least “vietsub” (localize) international culture when bringing it into Vietnam.
If you look at NEO- 's menu, all of Deme's beers have Vietnamese names: Ba Hoa, Hơi Hơi, Quất Đê!, Mập Mờ. Currently about 70% of our customers are foreigners, but we still choose Vietnamese names. I would say it is an icebreaker to our customers, because they might get curious when they read the names.
For example, the name Ba Hoa is inspired by the recipe of combining (more than) three types of hops. But instead of technically describing different flavor layers like many craft breweries do, we choose a more emotional expression. We often joked: “Vào Ba Hoa ra nói chuyện” (Open a Ba Hoa, open up the talk), because its alcohol level is stronger than the usual beer in Vietnam. Anyway, this is a good choice if you are looking for a good time. And if you’re introverted, who knows you might flip to any other -vert!
After a few years of only selling Ba Hoa, we developed a new line of beers with lower ABV.
One of them is Hơi Hơi, meaning "slightly". It’s light enough to drink as much as bia hơi - draft beer (with alcohol content and bitterness close to IPA standards), yet it carries a signature flavor all its own.
Another is Quất Đê! It takes inspiration from Germany's classic Radler beer style, but renews it by using local ingredients. I use a blend of fresh yuzu and kumquat (quất or tắc) from Western Vietnam to create a light sourness with a sweet finish, which is easy to drink. Quất isn't just distinctive for flavor, it's a cultural symbol. During Tet in Vietnam, people display quất plants in front of their houses to wish for a prosperous year. Seeing quất is seeing Tet, and hearing 'Quất Đê!' means a celebration is coming.
In short, while the product could have international appeal, once it is in Vietnam, it should feel more Vietnamese.
Even dishes adopted from Singapore, Malaysia, or the US are adapted to suit local tastes. Take potato wedges, for example: in Europe or America they’re often served with bacon, but here we pair them with lạp xưởng, our favorite Vietnamese sausage.
Was there a decision that others considered “illogical”, but that you chose to stand by because it stayed true to NEO-’s spirit?
Many people asked me: “Why go up to the rooftop just to sit on monoblocs?”
But why not?
I chose these chairs for NEO-'s rooftop because I want people to drink craft beer (a very American subculture) in a Vietnamese drinking style.
These plastic chairs have an interesting background. They’re everywhere in the world. There’s even a whole “antifan” that hates them because they can’t tell the aesthetic style of any era or place these chairs belong to. They’re not fancy, and they don’t express any personality.
But it’s hard to imagine any Vietnamese person not feeling a sense of familiarity with these plastic chairs. Lightweight, easy to move, and especially comfortable for long drinking sessions with friends. They embody the flexibility and collective spirit that define Vietnamese culture.
Business people often have their own philosophy. On your entrepreneurial journey, is there any motto you always remind yourself of?
“Just try it”.
I never knew the skills I gained at KFC would later be useful for running my own business. Or if I hadn’t taken on a design internship and taught myself along the way, I wouldn’t now be able to do the design for Deme and NEO-.
You never know what will become useful later, so just do it. Because, who knows that enjoying beer and beer talks would eventually lead me to selling beer?
Selling beer isn’t always fun, but drinking is. For you, what’s the most “đê mê”(ecstatic) moment when drinking beer?
Shooting the breeze about everything with friends.
You can ask your friends out and talk over coffee or soft drinks, of course. But beer is more fun, you know, “Vào Ba Hoa ra nói chuyện” (Open a Ba Hoa, open up the talk). (laughs)
I don’t encourage heavy drinking. But if you never let yourself get a little “đê mê” or let yourself be carried away, and truly connect with others, then it would be such a waste.
